I suggest, the first thing we should do, is make a glossary of all names and general expressions used in the game, so that we have a single standard for all the translators, which everyone must follow. When we were doing the original Pathologic translation we did make a glossary, that we can use as a base for our new, improved one. You can download it here:

http://pathologic.thelxr.info/glossary_2007.08.19.xls

I suggest, that the Englisg-speaking users look through the glossary and point out awkward-sounding or plain incorrect names and point them out in the topic.

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Предлагаю начать с составления глоссария имен собственных, неологизмов и часто-используемых в игре выражений, чтобы иметь некий единый стандарт, с которым мы затем будем работать. Во время работы над оригинальным переводом уже был составлен глоссарий, который я предлагаю положить в основу нового. Скачать его можно здесь:

http://pathologic.thelxr.info/glossary_2007.08.19.xls

Предлагаю русскоязычным пользователям добавить в глоссарий и русские названия мест, а затем подумать над адекватностью перевода.

One question worth discussing is whether names of characters should be russian or more english-sounding. For example in the old Swedish translation of lord of the rings Bilbo was called Bilbo Baggins, but now he is called Bilbo "Säcker", because the connotation for Swedish readers isn't the same with "Baggins" (bag in), due to the language.

Are there many names with word plays that only work in russian for example? Odong seems to be an example of what I'm talking about.

There seems, to me, be words in pathologic that are taken from their rightfull place and then made up in a way that has never been used before, and therefore in a way, "wrongly". "The Adherents" are an example. I do not think that this term can be applied to people, but I like the fact that it is anyway in Pathologic. It may seem like bad translation, but I don't mind it being that way.


Some terms:
Devotress, it sounds wrong, what is it supposed to mean exactly?
Burakh, it doesn't have anything to do with beetroot, right? In Polish, Burak means just that.
Laska in Polish means "babe", any connection?

We'll discuss my first question in this thread before I go through all the terms though.

Well, adapting the names sounds like a good idea - many Russian surnames derive from normal words, and in some cases are metaphoric, though not in many ones. I'll look through the glossary tonight to see which ones can be safely adapted.

Odong is a total neologism, which was supposedly a distorted form of Olgoy-Horhoy - a wyrm in Moldavian (?) mythology, but, I think the connection is so vague, that it's better to leave it as is. Other made up words include (full list, just checked):

- Odong (plural = Odonghe);
- Bos - a honourable title for, literally, a boss. ) (Halfgild Wynac: Boos, not Bos)
- Oinon - a honourable title for a well educated, wise person. Used much like sensei in Japanesse - for example Haruspex (or Haruspiccus, speaking of which) addresses the pachelo Oinon.
- Suok - Black, evil, weird source from the beyond in steppe inhabitants' kult.
- Tekhe - "A soul not transited to the beyond world in
steppe inhabitants' kult. "
- Udurg - "The most complicated term in
steppe inhabitants' kult: the body including the world in it. "
- Gorkhon River to the north from the town

Don't think, that we should modify these terms.
On the other hand the following are in question:

- Haruspicus - I remember we were using Haruspex up to some point. Do you know which one is right? The Haruspicus were figures in roman mythology, that used to predict events using animals (bulls) organs.

- Devotress - In the original, the third characters "codename" is Impostress - if you've played through her storyline and managed to get through all the gibberish you should know why - all the time the girl is acting like one. We didn't like the tern Impostress, for it sounded quite wrong in a way, a word that i personally don't associate with a female. Then Devotress was made up as a derivate from "to devote" - one devoted to the town... Something like that. If anyone has any ideas - let's discuss.

- General Blok - suggest changing to Block.

- Bugaika - meaning a massive kid, very dangerous in a fight - a nickname. The massive part being the root.

- George Kain - Cane maybe, or Kane?

- Gryph - well, a Gryph he is. )

- Laska - the name doesn't mean anything close to a prostitute. She's supposed to be a very nice girl, with a beautiful sounding name. Laska also means:
1) caress, endearment;
2) kindness
3) weasel

- Burakh is just a very popular Turkish surname.

- Mishka - can be transalted as Michael', or a teddy bear at the same time.

- Notkin - root of the surname means "music note"

- Ospina - translated as pock.

- Spichka - translated as match (the one that makes fire)

- Braga - Gangster-murderer, was a henchman of Gryph. Also means an alcoholic drink, homebrew I think.

- Doghead - well, the kids wearing dog head masks are. )

- Shavers/Shavermen - a group of criminals, name of gang derives from shaving blade in Russian.

- Vera - name can be literally translated as Faith. Heard this name somewhere in English.

Now for the other terms:

- Adherents - in original, meaning a close, trusted (entriusted?) person.

The map

Most of the names on the map represent an organ, or a body part, since the city itself is an Udurg, a living creature.

Well, I'm done for now, but will come back to add later, after I get my sleeeeep...z.z.zz.zzzzzzzz

I would vote for different transliterations of the following names, simply to avoid uncommon letter combinations: "Oynon" instead of "Oinon" and "Gorhon" instead of "Gorkhon".

"Boss" is also used as an honourary title. It seems like the most adequate translation.

"Haruspex" is definitely the better choice. It is much easier to research than "Haruspicus". This is important, since it is not at all a common term.

The link to "devote" in "Devotress" is not obvious, and the "ess" suffix is archaic. The word has a high chance of being perceived as nonsense. I would prefer "Impostor". English does not have word genders, especially the modern language, so "Impostress" seems out of place. "Impostor" does have a negative connotation, but so does the original Russian name.

"Cain" would make the biblical reference most obvious, but Kain is also good.

I like the idea of translating "Vera" to "Faith". It is a normal name and it has the right connotation.

Avoiding uncommon letter combinations can be a good thing, depending on the audience and what path we take in the translation. I, for example, have nothing against being reminded that the game is "placed in russia", and russian names add a bit of exotic touch and reminds us of its roots.

Impostor sounds good, although the name doesn't occur always, and even although I understood that Klara and... the other person were actually the same during my Bachelor scenario, it was told towards the end of the game. What I mean is that we should have two names then, Impostor, and another version of devotress.

I agree on Boss and Haruspex, but don't understand your explanation about Vera.

Vera means faith (belief) in Russian - so, since I've heard an English analog, I think we'd best use it. As for Boss and Haruspex - I'll guess, we'll use there variations of their names.
Well, we might just leave Impostor as is - there wasn't a second name for Klara in the Russian version.

Oh yeah, all the additions and modifications to the glossary should be done before Monday, the 21 of August.

What, you mean today? I thought we had time!

I agree on most things, although there are a few pointers:

George Kain/Cain is best, because Cane actually means something and I'm assuming that the most obvious reference (biblical) is the right one. Kain, again, sounds more exotic than Cain.

Concerning Mishka/Spichka, how important do we deem their roots to be? I'm having a hard time imagining Mishka as "Teddy" or "Ted", but then again it might sound like that i russian--perhaps not petronizing, but still full of contrast.

"Ospina - translated as pock."

Pock?

Oops, wrong date. I meant Monday, the 27.
Yeah, the thing that pops on skin and iches like hell ))

Sorry for absence, I caught flu.

I think that "Razormen" sounds better then "Shavermen".

And what about Gryph("vulture" in English)?
His real name is Grigory Filin (Grigory "Eagle-owl"), this is another word play.

Flu is the perfect excuse for sitting in front of the computer, but not to absence!

Razormen actually sound better. Although I think people know what gryph means, especially since Harry Potter came out, but the spelling is a bit deceiving. Other opinions?

I translated some word

Sandly Flu - Lethal disease.
Stamateene Inn - Utopist's bar
Khain's - family, which rule the Settlement
Bakalaure - First Character
Haruspeek - Second Character
Rouge - Third Character
Maenhue - men, who know, lines
Shabnack-Adyrh - daemon
Firemans - men with Molotov Cocktail
General Block - general of army
Aglaia Lilich - Inquisitor-Executer
Isidore Burah - Father of Haruspeek
Tellman - enemy of Bakalaure Theory of the Death
Cutters - Bandits
Patrolman - Saburov's men
Sanitars - men, who burn rat, cutters and other.
Bos Turhoh - great bull
Grandmaster Oiune - master of Boiny
Mor - Sandly Flu
Oudoorgh - what, which Great as world (UDURG read as [udiog] )
Married on Ground - helper's of the odong.

The circus is gone, but the sideshow freaks have stayed... ))))))

Lukash, not bad! But why change so much, don't you think that most of those names work already? And what do you mean with "sandly flu" and "mor", are those the names for us and for gamers, or are both for gamers but on different occasions?

Heteronymph, this for all. LxR, please don't feel hurt. I want to help you are all. . I am not a freak! If you don't agree with me, just say.
I want become your friend. This is forum for all. And all can help you. I translated words as very better form. I read messages and write this words. May be it isn't true. But I write yet. I like translate. Don't beat me your words. And translated word's in best form.

About the three main characters and their "titles" - my first impression of them was utter confusion. The commonly-used dictionary word "Bachelor" seemed completely incongruous with "Haruspicus" and "Devotress", neither of which meant anything to me. Personally, I would prefer dictionary words for all three titles - it would be less confronting for the player.

To me, it seems more logical that the titles should reflect the roles played by the characters within the game. I haven't played through the Haruspicus storyline - but if he is indeed a "Haruspex", I think a more generic term would be appropriate - "The Seer", for example, or "The Diviner". And why is Daniel "The Bachelor", anyway? Couldn't he be "The Doctor"?

As for "Devotress" - that title immediately made me think she was some sort of priestess or religious figure. What do you mean by her being an "impostor"? What is she pretending to be? I really can't suggest an alternative title until I know more about her character: could someone give me a brief summary?

"Disinfectionists" doesn't sound right - in fact, I'm not even sure this can be translated into a single English words. Perhaps it could be followed by something like "agents"? "Purification Agents" or "Neutralisation Agents" seem better terms to me.

What does "twyre" mean? Is that a particular variety of herb unique to the game, or is it just a generic word for "herb" used by the townsfolk?

Does "Humpback" actually have a hump on his back? The more widely-used term would be "Hunchback".

"Infected" really doesn't work as a noun: the sentence, "He is an infected," doesn't make sense. "Carrier" might be suitable as a single word, but it's very generic - "Plaguebearer" might be an idea. Does the disease ever have a name? In English, a person afflicted with "leprosy" is referred to as a "leper" - perhaps an adaptation of this sort might work.

Why are there two different words for "Odong"? This is confusing. I'd suggest getting rid of "Worm" altogether, since Odongs are not, in fact, worms.

"Adherents" just seems strange. Could they be collectively referred to as something like "The Circle"?

"Apiary" is a fantastic choice of word - with the drawback that I doubt most players would know what it means. Perhaps an NPC, when referring to the Apiary, could say something like, "You know - like a great big beehive," just to clarify.

What does "Wudei" mean?

What does "Long taglur" mean? I don't understand this at all.

What does "Bloody One" refer to? Battle skills? Is it supposed to be a laudatory title? It doesn't sound like it - to me, "Bloody One" has a very negative connotation.

"Womb One" doesn't sound right. "Wombchild" or "Womb Dweller" could be more appropriate. Is this term supposed to be derogatory? Something like "Womb Lurker", maybe?

Is "Trouble-maker" another title for a character? Could "Catalyst" work?

"Turokh" doesn't immediately bring bulls to mind - is this an actual Russian word? Could it be adjusted to something like "Tauro"? ("Taur" is the Latin root, I think).

I really like the exotic feeling to the place names, but again, it's a bit overwhelming to have all these unfamiliar words thrown at you the moment you begin the game. Would it be possible to append "District" onto the end of some of the dictionary words like "Heart", "Womb" etc?

Why do "Seine", "Slough" and "Clot" have their own names? I would suggest appending "Manor" or similar onto the end, for clarity, or else preceding them with "The".

Likewise, why does one particular "Stairway to Heaven" have its own name? If this is really necessary, I'd say its name needs to be linked to the generic "Stairway to Heaven" term.

Phew, I'm exhausted! I do hope you find my comments useful.

Sorry, if I hurt your feelings or anything - now, when I had the time to read everything - I see that it's quite good! though you should work on some things. ) I understand your logic and respect adapted translations, but to me Pathologicc is something special... A game, where there were almost no stereotypes in speech (in the original, of course), so I would like to stay as close as possible to the original text. Anyhow, all remarks about awkward and odd sounding stuff are still welcome. As for the main characters - I myself didn't know what Haruspex meant - for I don't have a degree in ancient histry. But, I quickly understood, what that meant, and the name does suit him very well. BTW, the man on Haruspex's photo is actually the man behind all the 1200+ pages of text in game. ))

OK, back to the titles, for now the best variant in my opinion is:
- Bachelor - could replace with another doctor degree, but I wouldn't like to see something like "The Doctor"...
- Haruspex -

If the "Devotress" does associate witth something religious, or miraclous, then this is just what we are looking for. Maybe, we could use both - Devotress and Impostor in the game... She's an Impostor, because through the game she always claims to be that, which she isn't... She and her twin sister are representations of a Miraclemaker and The Plague itself. Her scenario is all about finding herself and saving everything - the City and the Polyhedron (the miracle) inside it.
Yep, I don't like this one either, but can't think of a good synonim... Two words are fine, but I'd think a bit more about it - the guys with the flamethrowers kind of don't fit "Purification Agents" or "Neutralisation Agents". Also, is it allright to use "agent" - isn't it a contemporary word?
Twyre is a name for a sort of herb, a neologism.
Right. ) Let's use Hunchback.
plaguebearer is great, when a single word ought to be used. ) But I think we'll need to use the word Infected too. This gave me an idea - I'd add the lists of allowed and disallowed synonims to the list.
Hm... Well, its more literary that way, I guess. Also it's one of the few neologisms I'd like to keep. Also there's a slight difference between Odongs and worms - Worms are the ones that look iinhuman, but a butcher, for example, is also an Odong sometimes... Though I don't remember for sure - I'll check.

Yeah, may be a good idea, to call the group a name.
Good idea! We'll use it somewhere it hte dialogues on the first day.
I don't know, actually. ) We'll cross this one out for teh time being. Also clueless. Might be something from the Steppe mythology. Well get back to it on encounter...
Yep, it should sound as a negative name for Haruspex. Not sure. Will check.
Well, it's a name for a kid, so, I guess, troublemaker is good, but, Catalyst might work - don't know ehat the word means, actually. )
Yes! Could you do all the place names, as you think it'll be appropriate?
OK. Let's append Manor. )
Well, I'd keep "stairways to heaven" as a general name for ruins, and Polyhedron, as it plays a special role. I'm going to soon write about what the game is really about. Stay tuned.
Very!

ZOMG, I read the Glossary, so here are my remarks and suggestions.
The common remark is: DON’T MAKE THINGS TOO COMPLICATED UNLESS YOU HAVE TO.

1. Haruspex.
To my mind "Haruspex" sounds and looks much, much better than "Haruspicus".
I would remove the letter K from the surname "Burakh" as well. "Burah" looks better for me, again.

2. Bachelor
I would change "Dankovskiy" to "Dankovsky". Players will have to read a lot, and I think that the second variant is just easier and doesn't look so... err... alien.
As for his degree (bachelor) - I guess, there was an explanation in the game. He is a scientist after all, and not just a doctor from a hospital.

3. Inquisitor.
Once more, "Aglaja" ----> "Aglaya". Maybe it's just me, but I think that the letter J must be gotten rid of, 'cause it just gives the word an outlandish and uncomfortable flavor.

4. The Twins
Andrew and Peter, maybe? Not sure though.

5. Clara
Are you sure you want her name to be written as "Klara"? Impostress, I would say, is the best nickname for her. Someone here said, that the suffix "-ess" is archaic, but I would say, all the game is a bit archaic, so the nickname “Impostress” fits just fine.

6. The General
“Block” I would say... And “Ash General”, not “General Ash”.

7. Two Vlads
Olgimskiy ----> Olgimsky (see paragraph 2)
And what about the Junior Vlad?

8. Aijan ----> Ayan

9. Disinfectionists
Arsonists, maybe?

10. The worms
I would say that the plural form from “Odong” should be “Odongs”.

11. Patrolguard
Why not just a “patrol” or a “guard” (guardian)?

12. Shavermen
To me it sound like goys who like “shaverma”... “Razormen” is the best variant, I would say.

13. Vera
Ah, yes, yes, translating her name as Faith is a good idea. Just like in Dreamfall.

14. Apiary
Maybe just “beehive”, no? Or “termitary”?

15. Abbatoir
“Shambles”, maybe? Abbatoir is just so... rare...

16. Knots
If we are talking about a body, they should be “nodes”. Knots are on the rope or a thread.

17. Horns
I would call the Kain’s residence a “Forge”, ‘cause “horns” remind of a bull in the first place.

18. Waste of the Bone Pillar
“Bone Pillar Waste” it is.

19. Long and Short block
Corps or building maybe? ‘Cause “block” is a part of the city, and here we mean just one building, large though it is.

Nat. You write true. End of surname -skiy not availible, -sky is very good form. It is Poland surname. Surname not translated! Grigory Filin, in Africa Grigory Filin. In naturally, U before R read as IO. I translate Uprava as Prison'n'Post(PnPost). Omut translate as Wild Water. City must call Settlement(Poselenie) or Village(Gorodok-dyra). And I think, Haruspex listen better. And Bachelor too.
P.S. This section will be better, if you write which words had been searched it mean.

Some points that were not touched yet.

1/ Mark Immortal
The adjective and the name of a herb have the same root both in Russian and in English. So there is no problem and for more accurate translation it should be changed into Immortelle.

2/ Lara Ravel
In Russian her surname doesn't have any special meaning but in English it does ("mess" or something). If we need to avoid this - the spelling should be changed, without changing the transcription. It'll be "Ravell" or "Ravelle", I guess?

3/ Shouldn't we name Big Vlad Elder (not Older) Olgimsky as it reflects family relations?

...
I liked Heteronymph's idea to translate "Mishka" as "Teddy". In both languages it sounds like a boy's name, but in the game refers to a girl (it always seemed strange to me ^_^), and they both are meaningful.

In whole, I think, so-called "talking names" should be translated... With nicknames it's easier, but I can't imagine good equivalents for "Laska" or "Kapella" just now.

Hm, I wonder, if we could say just "slaughter-house" instead of "abattoir"? It's a pity I have no dictionary to look up stylistic colouring (...

I translate this phrases. ...Settlement is chimera. Threeheaded chimera. First head fall(Khains), second head stand up(Olgimskies), third head is in agonies(Saburovs)...
...People called you, Bachalor, snake on wings of death...
Day is ending. Works, which You do, don't get danger your ...(Priblizhenye). Masks in Theatre, show new Pantomime...

Nat, "abattoir" is the common word for a slaughterhouse - what makes you call it "rare"?

Ohh, is "Bachelor" supposed to refer to his education? In that case, it definitely has to go: the word is more commonly used to refer to an unmarried man. Perhaps "Scholar", or even "Scientist".

"Arsonist" implies unlawful activity. What authority does this "Var" have?

A title should come before a name, so "General Ash" would be correct - is there meant to be a double meaning in the name "Ash"? Could it be changed to "Ashton"? That's a more common name, and doesn't immediately bring fireplaces to mind! "Ash" is usually an abbreviation for "Ashley", which is a girl's name.
Ah, okay! I still think "One" sounds a bit awkward - how about "Blood Digger"? Or even "Butcher" might work - that's a word often used in reference to violent murderers.
Catalyst means someone who causes or triggers some sort of massive change - for a child, though, Troublemaker could definitely work. Or "Rascal". It just needs to be used carefully: "Troublemaker was here today," sounds wrong - it'd need to be, "That troublemaker was here today."
That would be really helpful - I only have a vague idea, to be honest.
Sure, but let me first see if I can make sense of them..

There are three "sectors", yes? The "Stone Yard", then "Knots", then "Earth". I really feel like these names need to be more obviously related - at the moment they seem as though they were chosen at random. Does anyone have any insight as to the origins of the names? There needs to be a really clear distinction between which names are "sectors" and which are districts".

So, from what I can gather, the sectors contain the following districts:

Stone Yard
-Bridge Quare
-Leaves

Knots
-Saddle
-Rib
-Spine
-Hearts
-Womb
-Kidney
-Muzzle
-???

Earth
-Warehouses
-Factories
-Tanners
-Dubilschiki
-Damp District

Any errors there? I'm sure I'm missing something, since Knots is supposed to contain 8 districts, not 7.

What would you say about "Eviscerator"?

Well, maybe it's just me, but it is the first time I saw this word here, while "shambles" is met more often... But if you say it's common, then okay, I don't mind.
Well, our Bachelor is unmarried But this nickname refers to his education, that's right... We should think of it together, but I doubt that LxR will remove this word willingly.
Var is a leader of fanatics. They have bottles with Molotov cocktail and they wander aroung plague blocks and burn plaguebearers. They say, they want to "burn the disease".
"Ash" here means "ashes", "cinder". It's a nickname of a General.

Why, in the game Haruspex is called "The Ripper" now and then! And other people from abbatoir who kill bulls are called "butchers". Both these names have a strong negative context, so why not just leave them like that?